RPG Skill Trees!

[Loony]

Hey guys;
The Concept Designers and I are currently planning for the next major update to the RPG plugin and one of the concepts we're working on is skill trees. If you aren't sure what skill trees are, here is the short version:

Skill Trees
Each element (including Chi and Avatar) will have their own skill trees that have variables that affect their element. This can be added damage, shorter cooldown, permission to use a move, using HealingWaters with bottles, etc. The skills in the skill tree are given by permission so that people can use Quests' plugins to give players' skills. However, you can define in the config.yml variables such as "Kill 20 players with move" "Use move 50 times" "Kill 45 chickens with move" etc.

What I ask from the community is for you to propose some concepts for the skill trees, whether that's actual skills players can earn or a concept on the skill tree system we've proposed.

Please leave your suggestions below because it allows me to reference all your suggestions at once, thanks!
~ Loony

 

[MeskenasBoii]

Levelling system? I thought Mist wanted nothing to do with it, as it would encourage unfairness to the game and takes out the fun of it (according to him).

 

[Loony]

Levelling system? I thought Mist wanted nothing to do with it, as it would encourage unfairness to the game and takes out the fun of it (according to him).

That's not how it's designed;
It's mostly aimed for RPG sever's that want people to earn their abilities / parts of their ability. This concept gives someone the tools to create a server that matches how bending worked in the show, gradually progressing.

 

[MeskenasBoii]

I still see it the exact same thing :| "This concept gives someone the tools to create a server that matches how bending worked in the show, gradually progressing." You gain abilities by practising and doing the x ability X amount of times , amaright?

 

[YourAverageNerd]

If you're doing this, don't just make abilities stronger over time. Grants access to certain parts of them and some abilities in general, such as torrent wave or surge freeze.

 

[MeskenasBoii]

However, you can define in the config.yml variables such as "Kill 20 players with move" "Use move 50 times" "Kill 45 chickens with move" etc.

I can see by this that I won't be liking this system already.

 

[Loony]

If you're doing this, don't just make abilities stronger over time. Grants access to certain parts of them and some abilities in general, such as torrent wave or surge freeze.

I still see it the exact same thing :| "This concept gives someone the tools to create a server that matches how bending worked in the show, gradually progressing." You gain abilities by practising and doing the x ability X amount of times , amaright?

Nah, we're going to avoid using abilities for X amount of times to make them stronger, I just used that as an example.
As for "gradually progressing" I mean that in the sense that that's what it will feel like when you earn your abilities and unlock new skills. Like I said, we give the tools to create such a server, because if you combine it with a Quests plugin there's potential to re-create the entire story line of the Avatar universe, taking people on the same path a character from the show went on -- The possibilities are endless.

Things we're trying to avoid with skill trees:
- Using moves X amount of times to earn skill points
- Adding damage onto ability moves / Making bending stronger

You aren't going to be using moves X amounts to upgrade them because that isn't how the system is designed. You're going to be able to gain skill points in whatever way the server provides which will then allow you to spend those skill points on different skills; eg. using HealingWaters with bottles / access to Icebending.

Hope that cleared things up!

 

[MeskenasBoii]

eg. using HealingWaters with bottles / access to Icebending.

Things we're trying to avoid with skill trees:
- Using moves X amount of times to earn skill points

Contradiction-- oh you mean sub access? Well that still technically contradicting. I'm confused as to why you approve that over another, when that still is pretty much 'levelling system' alike concept.

The Reason why I hate this, because it definantly gives unfair advantage to you. Imagine, I come to a new server to battle, for the sake to battle. I'm a newcomer, and some stupid server assign me with "watermanipulation" ability as my only move. As I said, I only came here to have fun by sparring others with bending, not do some survival quest. I can't come to the arena, because I know I'll be screwed and rekt because long time players (which are probably bigger in odd of appearing in numbers) and it just unfair fighting something that has 7 or more abilities unlocked vs me with 1 ability.

No I have nothing against the servers that customize and applies this kind of system. I just(will) hate that PK supports it, and when the plugin supports it - more players probably will be intrigued of using. PK surely needs to limited, so that it doesn't give to much control. Having some kind restrictions such as healingwaters should be accomped with torrent, watermanipulation, otheroffensivemove so the other abilities could be unavailable at the time for newbies; or like more than 3 abilities must be set to start off, or only gaining new sub could be while having to keep non-subabilities without needing to level up.

 

[Loony]

Contradiction-- oh you mean sub access? Well that still technically contradicting. I'm confused as to why you approve that over another, when that still is pretty much 'levelling system' alike concept.

It isn't a levelling system, it's a skill tree. They're completely different things.

I don't have a finalized list of skills or how to obtain them or I wouldn't be posting

 

[Loony]

What I can say is that what's on the skill tree will be configurable so the examples I am giving are completely optional.

 

[SuperBower118]

Each element (including Chi and Avatar) will have their own skill trees that have variables that affect their element. This can be added damage, shorter cooldown, permission to use a move, using HealingWaters with bottles, etc. The skills in the skill tree are given by permission so that people can use Quests' plugins to give players' skills.

So this whole Skill Tree is going to allow for new abilities instead of new features on existing moves? Can you define exactly what would be appropriate for a skill?

 

[Loony]

So this whole Skill Tree is going to allow for new abilities instead of new features on existing moves? Can you define exactly what would be appropriate for a skill?

Sure, here's what's appropriate (although this isn't a finalized list, you guys can suggest anything but here's what I've got);

• Access to ability/subelement
• Access to part of an ability - This includes things like using HealingWaters with bottles or even using the freeze feature of Torrent, the list goes on.
  
• X moves blocks more moves - So if AirShield blocks basic fire moves, adding this skill would allow AirShield to block more fire moves (example)
• Adds new features to abilities - Examples: effects such as slowness to ice moves, using WaterSpout as a source, using Ice you create from water as a water source.
• Ability changes - Examples: Increase Catapult speed, WallOfFire becomes taller and wider, AirSwipe does more knockback.

Those are just examples to be honest, we're still open to suggestions.

 

[Bumbullbee]

I know I'm probably going to be put down for saying this, but I love everything about this. This is the exact kind of thing I've been looking for! It will give players something more to do than "Fight or survive, maybe build a house or something, I don't know/care". The only things I can hope for are a comprehensive and easy-to-understand skilltree. (So I don't have to explain it 200 times/refer everyone to some forum post)

I hope this all comes together nicely, A lot of others and I are looking forward to it!

 

[MeskenasBoii]

Sure, here's what's appropriate (although this isn't a finalized list, you guys can suggest anything but here's what I've got);

• Access to ability/subelement
• Access to part of an ability - This includes things like using HealingWaters with bottles or even using the freeze feature of Torrent, the list goes on.
  
• X moves blocks more moves - So if AirShield blocks basic fire moves, adding this skill would allow AirShield to block more fire moves (example)
• Adds new features to abilities - Examples: effects such as slowness to ice moves, using WaterSpout as a source, using Ice you create from water as a water source.
• Ability changes - Examples: Increase Catapult speed, WallOfFire becomes taller and wider, AirSwipe does more knockback.

Those are just examples to be honest, we're still open to suggestions.

I would probably like this it if it didn't include the first bullet-point feature (Access to ability/subelement). I don't want start playing in a server where I start with watermanipulation only. It makes no sense. Maybe the subelement part could stay, but not the non-sub abilities.

 

[SuperBower118]

Sure, here's what's appropriate (although this isn't a finalized list, you guys can suggest anything but here's what I've got);

• Access to ability/subelement
• Access to part of an ability - This includes things like using HealingWaters with bottles or even using the freeze feature of Torrent, the list goes on.
  
• X moves blocks more moves - So if AirShield blocks basic fire moves, adding this skill would allow AirShield to block more fire moves (example)
• Adds new features to abilities - Examples: effects such as slowness to ice moves, using WaterSpout as a source, using Ice you create from water as a water source.
• Ability changes - Examples: Increase Catapult speed, WallOfFire becomes taller and wider, AirSwipe does more knockback.

Those are just examples to be honest, we're still open to suggestions.

This basically seems similar to the Heroes plugin, along with McMMO. Regardless, some ideas I have are:
Airbenders and Chiblockers having to gain XP / Levels or whatever it is, to have it so that they don't take fall damage by default.

 

[Matt]

Why not just have "talent points" (could be for specific purposes like subelements, or just for the general element) that players could gain through means the server owner would define, and then allow the said server owner to make their own configurable GUI talent tree that players could spend their talent points on.

 

[YourAverageNerd]

Contradiction-- oh you mean sub access? Well that still technically contradicting. I'm confused as to why you approve that over another, when that still is pretty much 'levelling system' alike concept.

The Reason why I hate this, because it definantly gives unfair advantage to you. Imagine, I come to a new server to battle, for the sake to battle. I'm a newcomer, and some stupid server assign me with "watermanipulation" ability as my only move. As I said, I only came here to have fun by sparring others with bending, not do some survival quest. I can't come to the arena, because I know I'll be screwed and rekt because long time players (which are probably bigger in odd of appearing in numbers) and it just unfair fighting something that has 7 or more abilities unlocked vs me with 1 ability.

No I have nothing against the servers that customize and applies this kind of system. I just(will) hate that PK supports it, and when the plugin supports it - more players probably will be intrigued of using. PK surely needs to limited, so that it doesn't give to much control. Having some kind restrictions such as healingwaters should be accomped with torrent, watermanipulation, otheroffensivemove so the other abilities could be unavailable at the time for newbies; or like more than 3 abilities must be set to start off, or only gaining new sub could be while having to keep non-subabilities without needing to level up.

Then don't go to that server.

 

[Simplicitee]

There should definitely be an api for addon abilities to use (finally another use of addons and rpg), and ways to configure the gui itself so everything can be enabled or disabled, a way to change what skills are need to get another one.

 

[MeskenasBoii]

Then don't go to that server.

Considering that most servers I go that include a levelling system have it ALWAYS me starting with that kind of ability, the "then don't go to that server" option isn't there for me.

That's how it will be. Server owners tend to do that for some reason, so if something isn't happening the way I wanted in everywhere, I do have the reason to ask PK to fix it. Remember, PK takes the responsibility of the quality on how bending should/must be played

 

[Loony]

I would probably like this it if it didn't include the first bullet-point feature (Access to ability/subelement). I don't want start playing in a server where I start with watermanipulation only. It makes no sense. Maybe the subelement part could stay, but not the non-sub abilities.

Like I said, it's configurable

This basically seems similar to the Heroes plugin, along with McMMO. Regardless, some ideas I have are:
Airbenders and Chiblockers having to gain XP / Levels or whatever it is, to have it so that they don't take fall damage by default.

It'a nothing like Heroes or McMMO since this directly affects bending rather than just damage or unlocking abilities.

Why not just have "talent points" (could be for specific purposes like subelements, or just for the general element) that players could gain through means the server owner would define, and then allow the said server owner to make their own configurable GUI talent tree that players could spend their talent points on.

Because it's a skill tree, that's what they're called lol.. Besides, "talent points" sounds worse imo.

There should definitely be an api for addon abilities to use (finally another use of addons and rpg), and ways to configure the gui itself so everything can be enabled or disabled, a way to change what skills are need to get another one.

There will be.