xNuminousx
Verified Member
Discuss this....
GOO
GOO
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Community Management Error?
- Thread starter xNuminousx
- Start date
MeskenasBoii
Verified Member
Where's the TL;DR version? 
xNuminousx
Verified Member
Which version?Where's the TL;DR version?
I would like to start with apologizing for the delays. I completely understand where you're coming from, and I too don't believe it is acceptable. I have an idea for what we need to do in regards to the development structure, how we should operate, and how we can change to get our releases out on a regular basis. I think the most important thing right now is for our team to get in a voice chat and discuss this matter. It is evident that we need a change. It's sad to say, but in the time I've been working at ProjectKorra we haven't released 1 update 'on time'. After we have released 1.8.3, I will propose my ideas to Mist, Kiam, and Omni. I would also like to raise your points, and see which we think is more preferable. I would also like to thank you for sticking with us, and your devotion to the community. I wish to do all I can for this project, and I hope over the next few weeks/months we can get our releases on track for you guys.
Might as well put my pm to you here as well since it addresses you and the community.
Firstly, thank you for bringing your concerns to my attention, feel free to do so at any time. I'd like to begin by pointing out that each developer for ProjectKorra is a volunteer, none of us get paid. That being said, it is difficult to maintain an active work schedule when things like school, work, and other various elements of life come into play. For example, two of our developers have serious personal/health issues that I am not at liberty to discuss, all of us attend school full time, and seven out of the nine of us have jobs. I can't expect people to drop their lives to come and work on ProjectKorra. The reason we haven't released yet is because we are waiting on some final work to be done by a developer who was supposedly finishing up his assignments but got caught up with school and didn't tell anyone. Nobody knew he wasn't working and therefore couldn't pick up his load. I hope this sheds a bit of light on some of the issues I need to work around and try to account for when I come up with our development schedule. If you have any further questions, concerns or comments please feel free to share them with me. I want to do what best helps the community stay connected with development.
SuperBower118
Verified Member
I appreciate you responding, but I think it'd be a huge step for staff to just openly admitting that some staff are not available, rather than to borderline reprimand the community with your scattered responses like these.
SuperBower118
Verified Member
I have to agree with this. At first, I was a bit worried when you mention don't tell a single person about deadlines, but my concerns were addressed when you mentioned of staff describing to us what the progress is like. As the PK Staff have said, no one is going to put down their life for PK. Therefore, because life tries your weakest links, and can strike quickly, it can be concluded that life can take away a Developer or two rather quickly and unexpectedly.
This is where the descriptions come in. Rather than giving us a rather bold and broad deadline, describe to us what's going on. Describe to us at least some of the major ideas that run around the Concept Designers' minds. Not only are these deadline proclamations a major detriment to PK's name, some of these posts and replies to the Community's questions of just what the hell is going on are answered rather condescendingly from time to time. You always claim that you're all human and that life bites you in the ass hard enough for it to derail you from the task at hand, which is totally fine, but then you turn around and answer us like you're on some sort of elevated stage. Rather you like it or not, these are some of the reasons why there are / were people out there that are disgusted with the direction that PK is going in and have quit the plugin.
The first step to solving a problem is identifying it.
Let's see if you've awakened your eyes a bit.
This is where the descriptions come in. Rather than giving us a rather bold and broad deadline, describe to us what's going on. Describe to us at least some of the major ideas that run around the Concept Designers' minds. Not only are these deadline proclamations a major detriment to PK's name, some of these posts and replies to the Community's questions of just what the hell is going on are answered rather condescendingly from time to time. You always claim that you're all human and that life bites you in the ass hard enough for it to derail you from the task at hand, which is totally fine, but then you turn around and answer us like you're on some sort of elevated stage. Rather you like it or not, these are some of the reasons why there are / were people out there that are disgusted with the direction that PK is going in and have quit the plugin.
The first step to solving a problem is identifying it.
Let's see if you've awakened your eyes a bit.
xNuminousx
Verified Member
Glad you agree with my suggestion
floory565
Verified Member
@OmniCypher Are we at liberty to compile a copy of ProjectKorra from GitHub and use that?
xNuminousx
Verified Member
Inappropriate topic for this thread....
floory565
Verified Member
On the contrary, it relates perfectly to the absence of an official release, which this topic is indirectly based upon.
Loony
Verified Member
Can I just say again that, you should not be relying on betas. Yes, we delay beta releases but they're beta's for a reason, not core releases. We disclaim that betas will be buggy and recommend that you don't use them for your public servers.
Yes you can.
MeskenasBoii
Verified Member
That is totally irrelevant. This thread should be discussed over lack of any input about the progress (of the staff) and its inaccurate date releases.
Might I add that we need some sort of who staff is active or not list page: or at very least, how many are and aren't If that's too personal. I suggested this 'Honest Opinion about the state of the forum', posted by @Mist, but since then nothing much done ir said about considering working on that idea.
While the trello thing is great to show us what PK plugins are up to, we still another type of a similar, except an organized and more in depth annoucement board that tells us things like: the number of idea that are complete for the upcoming stable, what isn't, and what are for future stuff (that could be split into "1.8.0 list to-do" and "after 1.8.0", as well for other sub-plugins).
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While it is possible it is HIGHLY recommended that you don't do so unless you have a decent grasp on Java and Maven and understand the game you are playing. You put your server at a very high risk by using them because our GitHub builds are considered bleeding releases. You will not receive individual support and we are not responsible for any issues that arise from you using one. Not to mention the fact that they are even more likely to contain bugs and harm your server than betas. All in all, I would disadvise using them.
Loony
Verified Member
It isn't irrelevant. The topic at hand is about how we aren't keeping to our release dates, and I'm saying that this shouldn't be that big of an issue because you shouldn't be using betas in the first place. Also, what Chris said - we have been giving input.
That isn't a resolution to the problem though, it's an excuse. You can't expect people to not update PK versions in the year (rough guess) it will take to go from 1.8.0 to 1.9.0. We release betas for a reason, and servers are obviously going to use them. The fact of the matter is we are giving release dates out, and we aren't sticking to them.
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Loony
Verified Member
I never said it's a resolution, and I'm not using it as an excuse. I'm simply stating that people should not be relying on betas as much as they do, they aren't recommended to use so they shouldn't be updating to the next beta all the time.
MeskenasBoii
Verified Member
Betas have nothing do with anything.... If they're are relevant, please tell me how (quote it from the thread or just highlight the part from the OP's pictures)? As Sobki mentioned: "we [you] are giving release dates out, and we aren't sticking to them.
I, as a fan myself, shouldn't be disappointed (by the project) for over a false annoucement dates of the releases. I know you aren't psychics and I'm not saying you should always be right when providing, but when that same mistakes keeps repeating it numerious of times - than excuse me, you shouldn't fool us by sticking to the words you say that most of the time don't come true. Why bother even mentioning the date than? I hate repeating myself (thought I wish you understood my point I'm trying to cross here whenever this subject is mentioned again), but I'm not asking to rush the build of a plugin. I'm just saying If you can't stick with your words: again, why bother still becoming broken record?
And If you see my rant as "He's making a big deal out of this?" - may I ask on how you would like it If [analogy] someone applied to developers, and they asked that they will start working on March, but then happen to not stick to doing what he said, and excused himself with saving "Well, sorry busy with life, ya know? I'll start working in [next month]!" and (s)he kept reusing the similar excuse over and over again while neglecting the duties and responsibilities on doing the job he volunteered for!
...How would like it If you were living with a roommate that you told that its their turn to take trash out/do the dishes and he kept skipping the housework by overusing the "I'll promise I'll do it withn the few next hours"? How would you like it If your friend had borrowed $60 and kept repeating the same excuse "I'll return the money I owe you on Monday" 6 in a row every monday after the promise? Don't know, but that would sure annoy me and so I do think to you too.
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Another, I love how you quote me but not SuperBower117 is clearer and on point spot on... maybe I'm salty, but I think he rekted you two both xD Anywho: I won't be responding to this with the arguments anymore for this subject.
MeskenasBoii
Verified Member
Well, thanks for being open minded and I hope you manage to convince the others that this is kinda a big deal
This thread just made me realized that it might not be the delay of the project that keeps the community inactive/dead in a big different, but it's probably the thing that xNuminous and SuperBower118 pointed out