(Fire)[Combustion] Combustion Reworking

[SuperBower118]

Combustion bending in the show was a very rare technique, with only two people in total shown to have this ability. Both P'li and Combustion Man's blasts were deadly in their own aspects, with P'li's blasts having the ability to curve around objects and Combustion Man's blasts containing, in my opinion, greater power than P'li's. Currently, I feel that the stock combustion that is provided mainly demonstrates Combustion Man's Blasts, but I also feel that Combustion right now feels a bit too underpowering compared to the Combustion Bending that we saw in the show, despite the fact that Combustion deals a large amount of damage. Because of these reasons, I am proposing that combustion should be changed in the following ways.

To start Combustion, you'd first need to hold sneak for two seconds. After two seconds, you'd see a some spark particles appear for a second or so, indicating that you have a charge. Now that you have the charge, you can Left click to launch a combustion blast (Looks like the default combustion) that you can curve by holding sneak. When holding sneak, it will follow your mouse until you either left click to detonate it, or it hits a person or terrain, dealing 3.5 hearts of initial damage at day time. At night, it'd deal 3 hearts of initial damage. Once you have a charge, you can also sneak to launch an extended combustion blast. The extended blast would look like the stock combustion also, but it would have a longer trail of the white spark particles. The extended blast would do 4 hearts of initial damage, At night, the damage would also be 4 hearts of initial damage. The extended blast would have a range twice that of the stock combustion, and would go 1.5x the speed of the left click combustion.

Sneaking with Fireshield would reduce the damage done by the extended combustion to 2.5 hearts of initial damage if you are hit by the left click combustion while sneaking. (3 hearts of damage if you are hit by the static combustion) However, when you are hit, you would recieve a cooldown of 4.5 seconds on fireshield, meaning you are practically defenseless and you are unable to perform any FireCombos that include FireShield in it.

If you go out of the Combustion slot while you have a charge, you would lose that charge, and the cooldown for the combustion would activate. The cooldown for this improved combustion would have an extra 1.5 seconds added to it. If you are hit while you are charging up, the charge-up would stop, and the cooldown would activate. If you are hit while you have a charge, you would receive 4 hearts of initial damage

 

[Taiko the Waterbender]

I love it.

 

[Finn_Bueno_]

Would the extended combustion be redirectable ?

 

[promancer]

Sorry, this has to be said. This ability is a little op. Just because things are canon doesnt neccessarily mean they should be added. Thats why I suggest you add a HUGE risk to this move, as it is a double edged sword, and should deal somewhere around the range of 7-8 hearts when backfired. It has been shown that every time combustion backfires the combustion bender is either killed or nearly so. This is a fair trade for a DoT and AoE move with twice the range and its massive burn damage.

 

[SuperBower118]

Would the extended combustion be redirectable ?

No, it would not be able to be redirectable. It would be a straight line, just like the regular combustion.

Sorry, this has to be said. This ability is a little op. Just because things are canon doesnt neccessarily mean they should be added. Thats why I suggest you add a HUGE risk to this move, as it is a double edged sword, and should deal somewhere around the range of 7-8 hearts when backfired. It has been shown that every time combustion backfires the combustion bender is either killed or nearly so. This is a fair trade for a DoT and AoE move with twice the range and its massive burn damage.

I'll make the consequences a bit higher if you get hit while you have a charge, or if you're charging, but remember. It can be fairly easy to hit you while you're charging if you're at medium range from your opponent. This means that the ability would be mostly effective at long range, where you can safely charge up and release. (this is much like how Combustion Man preferred to fight a majority of the time when he was trying to assassinate Aang) Regardless, I myself had a feeling this had the potential to be OP, but I wanted to see how the community reacted first. 8-7 hearts, however, would make this a very bad, or at least underused move most of the times. I would also like to point out that you sort of contradicted yourself there when you said just because it's canon doesn't mean it has to be added, but then you bring up the fact that every time a combustion bender backfired, it caused lethal damage to them, thus you had the suggestion for the backfire to be 8-7 hearts...

 

[promancer]

No, it would not be able to be redirectable. It would be a straight line, just like the regular combustion.

I'll make the consequences a bit higher if you get hit while you have a charge, or if you're charging, but remember. It can be fairly easy to hit you while you're charging if you're at medium range from your opponent. This means that the ability would be mostly effective at long range, where you can safely charge up and release. (this is much like how Combustion Man preferred to fight a majority of the time when he was trying to assassinate Aang) Regardless, I myself had a feeling this had the potential to be OP, but I wanted to see how the community reacted first. 8-7 hearts, however, would make this a very bad, or at least underused move most of the times. I would also like to point out that you sort of contradicted yourself there when you said just because it's canon doesn't mean it has to be added, but then you bring up the fact that every time a combustion bender backfired, it caused lethal damage to them, thus you had the suggestion for the backfire to be 8-7 hearts...

Well there are two sides to each argument, and i gave two answers. One answer for each side. And, this is logical, as if you are able to fire a blast strong enough to blow your enemy to shreds, it will do the same if not more damage to you if it backfired. Not to mention the range of how close it would be, the consequence for this move is fair. Adding all the damage together it would be almost a 1 hit kill BY DEFAULT. Three 1/2 hearts of damage plus 1 heart burn damage per second during the day and twice the range of normal combustion, add AoE to this and it becomes op. I dont think it should catch fire as this isnt shown in any gifs or the show.

 

[SuperBower118]

Well there are two sides to each argument, and i gave two answers. One answer for each side. And, this is logical, as if you are able to fire a blast strong enough to blow your enemy to shreds, it will do the same if not more damage to you if it backfired. Not to mention the range of how close it would be, the consequence for this move is fair. Adding all the damage together it would be almost a 1 hit kill BY DEFAULT. Three 1/2 hearts of damage plus 1 heart burn damage per second during the day and twice the range of normal combustion, add AoE to this and it becomes op. I dont think it should catch fire as this isnt shown in any gifs or the show.

If the blast backfired on you, I wouldn't imagine that it would do even MORE damage to the point where it's nearly 2x of the original, and even though it'd be right on top of you, if you get hit by a combustion, the blast would most likely have exploded right in front of you, or to the side of you. And what do you mean by adding all the damage together? You only have one charge and you have to use it on either the left click version in a short time frame. Let's not forget that this ability is most effective at long range for the following reasons
1: Getting close-up is considerably risky, as for if you get merely tapped by something, you'll get the consequences
2: You can get hit by your own explosion if you're right on top of your opponent (obviously)
3: Even at medium range, if your opponent sees the spark particles, they'll most likely know you have a deadly combustion charge ready and go on the defensive. At least you're at long range, they most likely won't notice the particles so easily.

And even at long, range, people can avoid a combustion.

1: People can use a transportation move (AirScooter, Firejet, SurgeJet, SwiftSwim, Catapult, etc. Even Chi can use AcrobatStance to improve the ability to perform evasive maneuvers)
2: People can block the move by either putting up some sort of obstacle. Even if the combustion user decides to choose the left click combustion, they still have to manually guild that, and even then, you can avoid the weaker combustion by using a mobility move. It'll become harder to guild the combustion as it gradually gets further away from you.
3: Airbenders can wreck a combustion with airshield
I find that burn damage is appropriate for this, maybe not for a full heart of burn damage, (I'll change that) don't forget that Combustion Bending is basically shooting OPed Fireblasts at people. (Fireblast in this case. In the show, combustion was spammable, but obviously we can't have that)

 

[promancer]

If the blast backfired on you, I wouldn't imagine that it would do even MORE damage to the point where it's nearly 2x of the original, and even though it'd be right on top of you, if you get hit by a combustion, the blast would most likely have exploded right in front of you, or to the side of you. And what do you mean by adding all the damage together? You only have one charge and you have to use it on either the left click version in a short time frame. Let's not forget that this ability is most effective at long range for the following reasons
1: Getting close-up is considerably risky, as for if you get merely tapped by something, you'll get the consequences
2: You can get hit by your own explosion if you're right on top of your opponent (obviously)
3: Even at medium range, if your opponent sees the spark particles, they'll most likely know you have a deadly combustion charge ready and go on the defensive. At least you're at long range, they most likely won't notice the particles so easily.

And even at long, range, people can avoid a combustion.

1: People can use a transportation move (AirScooter, Firejet, SurgeJet, SwiftSwim, Catapult, etc. Even Chi can use AcrobatStance to improve the ability to perform evasive maneuvers)
2: People can block the move by either putting up some sort of obstacle. Even if the combustion user decides to choose the left click combustion, they still have to manually guild that, and even then, you can avoid the weaker combustion by using a mobility move. It'll become harder to guild the combustion as it gradually gets further away from you.
3: Airbenders can wreck a combustion with airshield
I find that burn damage is appropriate for this, maybe not for a full heart of burn damage, (I'll change that) don't forget that Combustion Bending is basically shooting OPed Fireblasts at people. (Fireblast in this case. In the show, combustion was spammable, but obviously we can't have that)

Still, burn damage isnt shown in TLOK or TLA AT ALL for this move. Its already got maneuverablitiy, distance, burn damage, and Area of Effect damage. Burn damage just seems like a way to make it more op than it needs. If you want a DoT move, use fireblast or burst, but adding Damage over time to this is too much.

 

[SuperBower118]

Still, burn damage isnt shown in TLOK or TLA AT ALL for this move. Its already got maneuverablitiy, distance, burn damage, and Area of Effect damage. Burn damage just seems like a way to make it more op than it needs. If you want a DoT move, use fireblast or burst, but adding Damage over time to this is too much.

I remember reading a post saying that the PK Staff has decided to keep burn damage, I think it was because it was a minecraft feature, or something similar.
How is the damage in this too much? This is combustion we're talking about, not ordinary firebending. I've already listed ways to defend yourself from this move. On top of it's Warm Up time, along with it's long cooldown and the fact that getting close is a very risky move, this move seems pretty balanced in my eyes. The "damage" over time is a mere half a heart of burn damage, so you should really stop freaking out about it.

 

[promancer]

I remember reading a post saying that the PK Staff has decided to keep burn damage, I think it was because it was a minecraft feature, or something similar.
How is the damage in this too much? This is combustion we're talking about, not ordinary firebending. I've already listed ways to defend yourself from this move. On top of it's Warm Up time, along with it's long cooldown and the fact that getting close is a very risky move, this move seems pretty balanced in my eyes. The "damage" over time is a mere half a heart of burn damage, so you should really stop freaking out about it.

Im not freaking out, and throwing insults around wont change anything. And not all fire moves should do fire damage, this move has enough going for it. And as you said, this is COMBUSTION bending, not firebending. If its long ranged, leave DoT to close or meduim ranged combat.

 

[SuperBower118]

Im not freaking out, and throwing insults around wont change anything. And not all fire moves should do fire damage, this move has enough going for it.

I didn't try to insult you... but you stated that the DoT (which was half a heart) was a big deal, when it could be avoided by heatcontrol (if the firebender was in the heatcontrol slot when they got hit by a combustion) or if a person was in water when they got hit with the combustion. I can see why not all fire moves shouldn't do fire damage, but with this move, it's a raw offensive move that can be rendered null by a variety of defensive techniques. Even airswipe can block this as for I did not mention a change in airswipe blocking this move. I don't understand why you think this move has a lot going for it. AoE is to be expected- this move is literally called Combustion... The damage is understandable with the reasons that I have mentioned before. The fact that the left click version of the move may seem OP in theory considering that you can redirect it, in reality, you can try all you want to curve the blast around an ice sphere or even a raiseearth so that it hits an opponent, but that's going to take a nearly inhumane amount of direction skills if you want the combustion to bypass the obstacle and then curve back around so that it can hit the opponent.

 

[promancer]

I didn't try to insult you... but you stated that the DoT (which was half a heart) was a big deal, when it could be avoided by heatcontrol (if the firebender was in the heatcontrol slot when they got hit by a combustion) or if a person was in water when they got hit with the combustion. I can see why not all fire moves shouldn't do fire damage, but with this move, it's a raw offensive move that can be rendered null by a variety of defensive techniques. Even airswipe can block this as for I did not mention a change in airswipe blocking this move. I don't understand why you think this move has a lot going for it. AoE is to be expected- this move is literally called Combustion... The damage is understandable with the reasons that I have mentioned before. The fact that the left click version of the move may seem OP in theory considering that you can redirect it, in reality, you can try all you want to curve the blast around an ice sphere or even a raiseearth so that it hits an opponent, but that's going to take a nearly inhumane amount of direction skills if you want the combustion to bypass the obstacle and then curve back around so that it can hit the opponent.

Still, just because it can be slightly deflected (not to mention most AoE dmg goes through walls) doesnt mean it should get fire damage. As you said, it is COMBUSTION bending not regular FIREBENDING. As it is a concentrated beam of energy I fail to see how and why exactly it needs DoT damage.

 

[SuperBower118]

Still, just because it can be slightly deflected (not to mention most AoE dmg goes through walls) doesnt mean it should get fire damage. As you said, it is COMBUSTION bending not regular FIREBENDING. As it is a concentrated beam of energy I fail to see how and why exactly it needs DoT damage.

Would you really consider this DoT damage as it's just half a heart. Even though every portion of your health matters, it's most likely to regenerate a second later after you take damage from the burning effect. The main reason why I put that it should do burn damage is PK's decision to keep burn damage in firebending in general. Also, just because this has an AoE damage doesn't mean it will go through walls. You'll only get hit by the AoE if you plant your face firmly against the wall you're using for defense.

 

[promancer]

Would you really consider this DoT damage as it's just half a heart. Even though every portion of your health matters, it's most likely to regenerate a second later after you take damage from the burning effect. The main reason why I put that it should do burn damage is PK's decision to keep burn damage in firebending in general. Also, just because this has an AoE damage doesn't mean it will go through walls. You'll only get hit by the AoE if you plant your face firmly against the wall you're using for defense.

Again, just because firebending can ignite doesnt mean every move should. You said yourself that this is a long range attack, not a DoT attack like fireblast or other.

 

[SuperBower118]

Again, just because firebending can ignite doesnt mean every move should. You said yourself that this is a long range attack, not a DoT attack like firelast or other.

After reading I've decided to take out the burn damage option and make it all initial damage that you take if you're hit with Combustion. The Avatar Wiki makes it clear that Combustion is basically an explosive ray of destruction.
Unlike conventional firebending, which produces a flame from the body, the technique instead creates a powerful beam that explodes upon contact with a solid surface.[23] Combustionbending can instantaneously evaporate large bodies of water and counter fire attacks, as demonstrated by Combustion Man when he stopped Zuko's fire shield during a brief altercation at the Western Air Temple.[24] P'Li has also demonstrated that it is possible to curve the beams.
If you have any more complaints about this move, saying it's too OP, I'm going to disregard them since I've stated tons of times why this move isn't OP. This move is devastating to the opponent, and potentially the user and that's how it should be. I have, however, made the cooldown 1.5 seconds longer instead of just 1 second longer.

 

[FearlessPie121]

After reading I've decided to take out the burn damage option and make it all initial damage that you take if you're hit with Combustion. The Avatar Wiki makes it clear that Combustion is basically an explosive ray of destruction.
Unlike conventional firebending, which produces a flame from the body, the technique instead creates a powerful beam that explodes upon contact with a solid surface.[23] Combustionbending can instantaneously evaporate large bodies of water and counter fire attacks, as demonstrated by Combustion Man when he stopped Zuko's fire shield during a brief altercation at the Western Air Temple.[24] P'Li has also demonstrated that it is possible to curve the beams.
If you have any more complaints about this move, saying it's too OP, I'm going to disregard them since I've stated tons of times why this move isn't OP. This move is devastating to the opponent, and potentially the user and that's how it should be. I have, however, made the cooldown 1.5 seconds longer instead of just 1 second longer.

Agreed. Combustionbending is not meant to have a burn effect, but rather an explosive one.

 

[gangksta]

I like the alternate idea of the controllable/static versions but I feel like a point-and-click move doing 4.5 hearts of damage is unreasonable.

 

[FearlessPie121]

I like the alternate idea of the controllable/static versions but I feel like a point-and-click move doing 4.5 hearts of damage is unreasonable.

Maybe this can be something developers could change...?

 

[SuperBower118]

I like the alternate idea of the controllable/static versions but I feel like a point-and-click move doing 4.5 hearts of damage is unreasonable.

I'll downgrade it to four hearts.
The Speed of the shift combustion can work against you too, despite the fact that it has twice the range, if you're on a generally flat fighting area with a person, it'll make it hard to hit the person if you want to manually explode the combustion near them. But of course, you can always just try to hit them with the AoE by hitting ground.
The reason why I'm downgrading this just half a heart is because 3.5 hearts would just make the difference between the two combustion blasts a matter of the speed and the range. I designed the original idea this way because I want there to be a distinct difference the two combustion blasts' power.

Maybe this can be something developers could change...?

When it comes down to it, I'm pretty positive that the developers, if they accept this idea, will just make the damage along with the other features configurable. If people want 4.5 hearts of the static version, then they can edit the config into their favor.

 

[Finn_Bueno_]

Maybe this can be something developers could change...?

Since it is a damage value, the server owners would be able to.