Denied Waterarms: The Death of All Other Styles and How to Repair It

[Tidal_Force]

Waterarms is a powerful move, regardless of what server one goes on. It has multiple functions, ice that won't unfreeze, and ridiculously fast movement. This presents a problem for ways of waterbending that do not involve them. Given that waterarms is not a "fundamental move" to waterbending (as shown by the show TLA), they should have a trade-off when bound for other styles to be developed.

How it would function:
If a waterbender would have waterarms bound, certain abilities or mechanics would be taken away from them. I realize that such a thing is not canon, but it would improve the balance of bending. Keep in mind that the abilities that would be taken away could not be regained unless the bender removed waterarms from their hotbar.

Possible Moves that Would Be Removed:
Moves that could be removed would include moves that have a function covered by waterarms or moves that work too well with waterarms.
- Torrent (Covered by Spear)
- Surge (Covered by Spear and Grapple)
- Icespike (Covered by Freeze)
- Icewall (Allows near unreachability by conventional moves like torrent without the speed of waterarms)
- Icewave (Reaches through waterarms ice and allows constant freezing capability)
- SwiftSwim (Covered by Grapple)
- Bloodbending (Covered by Grab)

Possible Complaint: Waterarms Are Good Just Because of the Server You Play On:
I would like to point out that this is not true. The multiability function is overpowered on every server I have been on that have waterarms.

In Conclusion:
Waterarms should be an optional choice, not a prerequisite to being decent at water. I'm sure many other benders that are not water would agree with me on the fact that they present waterbenders with too much mobility and capability in one move. Please have an open mind to consider this way of balancing water.

 

[MeskenasBoii]

- Icewall (Allows near unreachability by conventional moves like torrent without the speed of waterarms)

Does this include all JedCore abilities?
@jedk1, start removing it, since this hater doesn't appreciate the work you done with this ability

 

[Tidal_Force]

Does this include all JedCore abilities?
@jedk1, start removing it, since this hater doesn't appreciate the work you done with this ability

Oh, I forgot that was a JedCore ability given it's on almost every server. No, for JedCore, it only applies to that particular move. You're also making a false assumption that I dislike waterarms/icewall (you were unclear with your pronoun) because I'm suggesting a nerf. This is not true. I think it provides an alternative way to waterbend that should not be the only way to waterbend.

 

[MeskenasBoii]

Possible Moves that Would Be Removed:
Moves that could be removed would include moves that have a function covered by waterarms or moves that work too well with waterarms.
- Torrent (Covered by Spear)
- Surge (Covered by Spear and Grapple)
- Icespike (Covered by Freeze)
- Icewall (Allows near unreachability by conventional moves like torrent without the speed of waterarms)
- Icewave (Reaches through waterarms ice and allows constant freezing capability)
- SwiftSwim (Covered by Grapple)

If they really start removing your listed abilities, which I would be hating this community if hey do such a thing, than I would add to your list more abilities that follow:
- WaterManipulation (Covered by Punch) [Counterparts to Icespike/Spear]
- Bloodbend (Covered by Grab)

... Wait, what I'm talking about?? I'm not gonna support your idea! This isn't the way to balance the ability. How would this change of yours would balance waterbending? Actually... I don't even know what else do you want to "fix" in waterbending, because either I don't know how to read or you didn't fundamental. In my opinion, this wouldn't prevent waterbenders to toggle-on their waterarms frequently, but it would become exact opposite thing of what you want.

Can you elaborate why do you think that it is over-powered? To me, waterarms is fine.

You're complaining that waterarms gives too much mobility for the wielder, but I don't get on why you suggest removable of swiftswim would solve that (unless your lists says in reverse - to remove the abilities written in closed brackets). Even removing the Grapple that still would be a issue, because it does match the canon representation of it. The Good balance for this multi-subability, is to tweak it so that it isn't to overused, such as long time to attach the tentacle or slower it will pull the grapple man. Besides that nerf, don't know about you, but I don't see waterarmed people that often grabbling around in every server, so I don't see it as a problem for waterarms having most mobile ability in its arsenal.


While I do not play that often play as a waterbender myself, it from my chi blocker or other bender perspective this alteration will make the bending art miserable to watch at.

 

[Tidal_Force]

If they really start removing your listed abilities, which I would be hating this community if hey do such a thing, than I would add to your list more abilities that follow:
- WaterManipulation (Covered by Punch) [Counterparts to Icespike/Spear]
- Bloodbend (Covered by Grab)

Watermanipulation is fundamental. All waterbenders deserve to have it.
Bloodbending is not allowed on many servers and those that have it won't be using waterarms.

How would this change of yours would balance waterbending? Actually... I don't even know what else do you want to "fix" in waterbending, because either I don't know how to read or you didn't fundamental.

While I do not play that often play as a waterbender myself

Your second quote shows that you shouldn't be talking about the subject because you have little knowledge about it. Secondly, waterarms is practically spammed on many servers. It's capabilities equate it to moves that I listed for possible removal above. I am not suggesting that all those moves be removed, either. They are simply possibilities that could be removed. Please do not attack me about my suggestions, I am simply trying to voice the concerns of many benders that I come across that dislike the current prerequisites to waterbending (such as _Catalyst).

but I don't get on why you suggest removable of swiftswim would solve that

Before I respond to this, I kindly ask that you stop editing your post so that the discussion can continue in a logical manner. The removal of swiftswim would solve an issue of too much mobility by preventing those with waterarms from having more mobility than they would already have. Keep in mind that those with waterarms can still use waterwave and grapple, which more than covers swiftswim.

 

[MeskenasBoii]

Right after you commented, I edit my reply with a new paragraph. You don't even have to be a usual waterbender to know how it is overpowered. Even If you think it is, I, as a chi blocker don't even see it op, otherwise I would biased over waterarms having restriction to not have advantage over chi blocker so that they can rekt me.

Bloodbending is not allowed on many servers and those that have it won't be using waterarms.

Why wouldn't they use waterarms? I been on a server where it is allowed, and most of them use waterarms nevertheless.

If SwiftSwim gets removed, what would that solve anything? Both of these mobile moves are different: with one you can travel on land, with other allowing to swim faster, hence the name. You don't want waterarms to be mobile, right? so If fastswim gets removed, it wouldn't change much to make the ability less op, except discouraging them to watercamp at all in general (the underpowered result is almost none noteworthy/minimal to waterarms).

 

[Tidal_Force]

If SwiftSwim gets removed, what would that solve anything? Both of these mobile moves are different: with one you can travel on land, with other allowing to swim faster, hence the name.

Yes, both of the mobility moves are different, but one of this suggestion's purposes is to limit the mobility of waterarms users period. By removing swiftswim, it gives them one less option for mobility and therefore will make them slower.

it wouldn't change much to make the ability less op

The purpose is to affect the style as a whole rather than just an individual ability.

except discouraging them to watercamp at all

Isn't this a good thing?

As to bloodbending, I haven't personally seen it, but I will add it to the list for you.

 

[MeskenasBoii]

• Are you referring to swiftswim in general or exclusive one during when the waterarms is active?
• ^ Other way, grapple would be the new spammed means of transportation that I believe is at the same or close to speed of the passive.
• You said it is overpowered, so I want you to elaborate the reason on why you think that so?
• It is a good thing, but I prefer that even without waterarms bound the passive would have to cease to exist or become disabled by default.
  

 

[Tidal_Force]

Are you referring to swiftswim in general or exclusive one during when the waterarms is active?

If waterarms is bound, swiftswim would no longer be an ability for the binder.

^ Other way, grapple would be the new spammed means of transportation that I believe is at the same or close to speed of the passive.

Waterarms users would have to move in short bursts rather than constant insane speed.

You said it is overpowered, so I want you to elaborate the reason on why you think that so?

Waterarms is overpowered because of the amount of functions it has. Additionally, it has unfreezable ice and slowing abilities.

It is a good thing, but I prefer that even without waterarms bound the passive would have to cease to exist or become disabled by default.

I actually would love to have swiftswim removed completely, but that is a discussion for another thread.

 

[Green]

I agree with the grapple thing totally you can get 100 blocks in 1 second it doesn't make any sense.....

 

[Loony]

I'm going to deny this. Not only is this not canon there are better ways to balance WaterBending / WaterArms than this. I for one think WaterArms is fine due to the max use configuration. These changes make WaterArms terrible and nobody would use it because the other moves are more useful because WaterArms has a long cooldown.

 

[Loony]

Also Tidal, to add on to the "WaterArms is OP on every server I've played on" I nerfed WaterArms a while back and I do recall you complaining it was "unusable" and "too weak"